The Mind-Body Medicine Revolution

Chris Hall (00:00)
Hello and welcome to the Healthy Wealth Experience. I am your host, Chris Hall, and I am very excited to share with you a guest that we have here, Dr. Eva Celeb. She is a medical doctor who has been a school instructor for Harvard Medical for 20 years. She’s written several books and she has a lot of really interesting

medical stuff that she’s been doing that’s like not your so your general ed type stuff. So I’m really excited to have her on the show. So, doctor, thank you so much for being here.

Eva (00:25)
I’m so happy to be here.

Chris Hall (00:26)
So I did kind of mention that you’ve been with Harvard Medical School for 20 years. Kind of tell me about your journey as a physician and kind of what let you do this part we’re in right now.

Eva (00:35)
Yeah, so I I started out like any other young person thinking that they were going to be to come doctors and Went to medical school at Boston University. I trained at Boston Medical Center But while I was there I I have the personality type It’s sort of that the leadership CEO get things done fix people save lives, right? so that was sort of if you if you transpose that from a business perspective to

Chris Hall (00:57)
Thank

Eva (01:02)
medical perspective, that person’s a person who’s running ICUs or running ERs. And that was my personality type, just to sort of give you a background. And that was my plan. My plan was to work in ICUs, do a fellowship in pulmonary medicine, but that was kind of cut short because in the second year of my residency, I was doing a procedure and was stuck with the needle that was in 1996 and the needle was infested with HIV. So back back in 96.

Chris Hall (01:10)
Thank

— my gosh.

Eva (01:31)
You know, it’s not like now, but it was basically a death sentence or a miserable life. I was one of the first people that was put on a slew of medications. It ended up being about 14 pills a day for six weeks to prevent conversion, to keep me from getting HIV. And that study had just come out from the NIH back then. So was one of the first people to be on that protocol.

Chris Hall (01:36)
Why not?

My gosh.

Eva (01:58)
And so you can imagine I’m 28 years old and you know, I’m single. I’ve owed like $200,000 worth of debt and medical school loans. you know, I’m complete distressed. I was in complete distress for six weeks. Not to mention I got sick from the medications. I cried a lot and I was gonna die alone. I was never going to be able to work. And what have I done? My parents co-signed on my loans. They’re gonna be stuck with this debt. What have I done?

And but during that six weeks, I also did some bargaining, think as many of us do. If there is a God, you know, I promise I’ll, you know, be a nicer person. I’ll be more compassionate. I’ll take care of the needy, you know, whatever it is I need to do, just let me live. So and during that time, I also had a think, you know, is this really what you want to be doing? — Is this way of practicing medicine your way? You know, this idea of

Chris Hall (02:29)
Hehehe.

Right.

Eva (02:49)
saving lives as opposed to supporting lives. know, fear of dying versus desire to live. And that was a big no for me. I said, if I make it through this, I don’t think I want to do this. I don’t want to spend my life doing these procedures. It’s just, again, to go back a little bit when I was younger before I decided to do what the society told me to do, which was go to medical school.

Chris Hall (02:53)
I like that.

you

Eva (03:14)
I wanted to be medicine woman. loved, you know, ISIS who moved things telepathically and the whole world of energy and alternative medicine. I was always fascinated by that. But because I was doing what I was supposed to do, I put it aside. So during those six weeks, I thought a lot about all of that. And so when everything turned out okay six weeks later, still had to continue getting tested for a year, but I thought, okay, I’m gonna change.

you know, my life around. I’m going to, I don’t know what I’m going to do, but I’ll do primary or current until I figure it out. And I followed a midwife around and learned all these things about people rather than procedures. And I took it very seriously. However, you know, just when you pick yourself up, you get knocked down again kind of thing. My dog died and then my grandfather died. And then somebody started harassing me and I had to hire a lawyer and take her to court.

And then my apartment burned down and I lost everything. I didn’t have renter’s insurance. Remember my debt. I still have a lot of debt. And then my father had a heart attack and that all happened within five months.

Chris Hall (04:17)
my gosh, the hits just keep coming.

Eva (04:18)
So that

was 1996. So every time I, you know, get knocked down, I’d cry, have a pity party, and then I’d figure it out and bring myself back up again. And, you know, change courses, change courses. So by the time my apartment burned down, which was a good five months later, I had nothing left. That was it. I was burnt out. I was done. I did not want to live anymore.

Chris Hall (04:23)
Wow.

This is…

Eva (04:41)
I didn’t have the energy to smile, to think, remember anything, to do anything at all. I wasn’t suicidal to the point where I would take my own life, but mostly because of how that would affect other people. And I just didn’t want to live. I had no energy. And that went on for probably five months, maybe six.

Chris Hall (04:59)
And

nobody can blame you for that. Like nobody.

Eva (05:00)
No, I was just miserable.

I just didn’t see the point. I kept saying, why me, why me, why me? And then one day after a friend took me out to dinner and said, we miss you, we want you back, I just woke up. I don’t know what happened. I just said, you’ve been asking the wrong question, Eva. The question is not why me, it’s why not me? You know, nature just as soon lets a forest fire burn as a flower bloom, it’s not personal. I say that all the time.

Chris Hall (05:05)
me.

That’s really good.

Eva (05:26)
Why are you taking this personally? Like life happens. It’s not what happens to you, it’s how you deal with it. And we need to figure out, I talked to myself in the third person, right? I said, I need to figure out why I feel victimized by life so easily. What part of me feels so unworthy? What part of me feels, you know, like I’m not enough or don’t have enough when I clearly do. You know, look at…

the people who have rallied and supported me. But my mind goes in the opposite direction. So that’s when I finished my residency and I got a job working as a primary care doctor in a Harvard hospital, which meant I was going to be teaching there. I took the opportunity to also volunteer at the Mind, Body, Medical Institute, which was also there at the time, with Herb Benson, to learn about all these things I was inquiring about, about stress, about, you know,

self-worth, cognitive-rable therapy, psychology, and all the other facets that support people to heal. Meditation, nutrition, exercise, spirituality. And I started volunteering there and applying, you know, those modalities, those interventions with myself and my patients. We all started getting better. Within a year, they hired me to be the medical director, and I started researching the research and coming up with understanding of how stress is applied and mind-body is applied to

not only our health but also our lives. That became my expertise. I started teaching that and that went on for 20 years. But during that time, was in my practice, I started hating my practice because they’re changing the model over to what it is today, which is this incentive model. And I started to look at my patients’ numbers and I said, I can’t do that. So.

The primary care job I quit after five years, I stayed on as medical director and stayed on as teaching at Harvard. And then I started studying with healers, what I always wanted to do. And opened up my own practice a year later in 2003, merging Eastern and Western medicine and coaching people to heal themselves. And I did that for a very long time until 2019.

And during that time wrote tons of books and that got brought into corporate environments to work with leaders. And I started shifting the model over into a coaching model and, you know, working with executives and coaches and companies and that sort of thing, which is what I do today. And I consult on all things in, you know, integrative medicine. So that’s my very long story to how I got here today.

Chris Hall (07:40)
that.

Well, that’s phenomenal. — So my background, I’m a financial advisor now. But before that, I spent 10 years as a pharmaceutical rep. And so, you know, I’m very aware of the medical formation, you know, the medical business, as you will. And so and I’ve seen people who, you know, have basically kind of been like, this is not why I got into medicine. So I think it’s really cool that you have a story. Obviously, you have a lot of, you know,

other circumstances that kind of like brought you to, you know, like a basic step of like, where do I go from here? So I love that. I love that you found this. I’m really interested in the integrative medicine. When I was a pharmaceutical rep, I always felt like that was something that was missed in the medical field as well. You did some research for medical marijuana before it became like, you know, pretty much, you know, it’s pretty easily had right now. But like you were doing the research on that. Can you tell me a little bit about that?

and how you got into that.

Eva (08:35)
I have a very inquisitive mind. And so I sort of, sort of get a hit or a ha and say, — well, that’s really interesting. Let me look into that and start understanding. So what I do is I translate the research into.

how it can be used practically and adaptively in medicine or in everyday life. you’ve got sort of like a researcher in Timbuktu is researching something very microscopic and minor. And then somebody else in New York is researching something else and then I’ll put them together. This is how they correlate. And then what happens is 10 years later, somebody else actually does the actual research, just improves those theories to be true.

Chris Hall (08:51)
Okay.

Okay, I love that.

Right. yeah, here you go.

Eva (09:15)
That’s kind of what’s

happened. And colleagues that we do that as well, we started seeing patterns. Like when I actually was in, in 19 or 1999, I was already recommending probiotics and omega-3s and I actually got in trouble for it. Vitamin D, I was, I got in trouble. They were like, what are you doing? is, this isn’t medicine. This isn’t real. Yeah. This is when I, yeah, this is when I was, yeah.

Chris Hall (09:36)
This is when you’re in primary care or this is when you were with Harvard?

Eva (09:41)
Yeah, I was getting

Chris Hall (09:41)
Okay.

Eva (09:42)
in trouble for recommending things that weren’t really proven yet. yeah, so that’s that’s a little bit of background on that. So my research is researching the research mostly and then doing clinical work. And with with with cannabis, it was really looking into what are different other pathways to support people who are in pain, and to look at the cannabinoid system and the opioid system in the in the body. And, you know, looking at also inflammation.

And I wrote this really great article. And then as it so happened, this company that I work on, I’m on the Board of Advisors saw the article and they said, wow, we need to have this person on our board. So I’ve been sitting on a board of as a board of directors in the cannabis company now for six years.

Chris Hall (10:24)
Mary Med. Did I say that correctly? Okay, that’s great. That’s great. I love that so much. So you had mentioned inflammation and so going back to when I was from SUQA rep, I sold Lipitor and so the number one prescribed statin in the world at the time and you know it was all about LDL and it was all about LDL and it was all about LDL and I kept looking at the studies and I kept reading them and very much like I’m a very inquisitive person I kept going like

Eva (10:25)
Yeah, Mary met.

Chris Hall (10:49)
Well, if it’s all about the LDL, how come like we’re not getting these massive reductions in death and events before people get really sick? Like why is there no primary prevention study? To my knowledge, and I could be wrong, if something’s come out, I’m sure somebody can tell me about it. But to my knowledge, after 30 years, we still don’t have a single primary prevention study on statins. Do you know if that’s true or not?

Eva (11:10)
I don’t know of it. I’m not a big fan of statins. So I don’t actually look for research for something that I don’t want to advocate for. I’m not going to tell people it’s bad to be on them. It’s like we don’t have that kind of data. But there are a lot of other things that one can do. And if we’re really targeting inflammation,

Chris Hall (11:15)
Me neither. Me neither. So yeah.

Okay.

Eva (11:35)
There’s other ways to target inflammation without having to take statins.

Chris Hall (11:40)
Yeah. So that was part of my journey is like near the end of my career. I got laid off in 2009 when everything else was going crazy for pharmaceuticals companies. There was like a massive layup. think we lost like 80 % of all sales reps got canned in that year. But right around then I remember thinking to myself like, don’t think this is what we’re, I think it was felt like a wild goose chase. And I knew that there was some data that was coming out at the time about inflammation.

Eva (11:51)
Yeah.

Chris Hall (12:04)
And so my knowledge of this is, you know, still pretty rudimentary, but basically, if you have inflammation in your arterial walls, the cholesterol will come in and sort of like, you know, putty it over, try to cool it down. And that’s how you get these plaques. And like we’re attacking the LDL, making it the monster, but really it’s the inflammation that’s the monster and we should figure out ways to do that. — And so I know you’ve done a lot of research on stress and stress is a huge factor when it comes to the

Eva (12:13)
That’s

That’s right.

Chris Hall (12:31)
the inflammation of the arterial walls. So can you talk a little bit about that research that you’ve done?

Eva (12:33)
That’s

Absolutely. And you’re 100 % right here. think for listeners who aren’t understanding anatomy, if you look at a blood vessel, it’s unlike the muscles on your bones that cover your bones, the muscles in your arteries are smooth for a reason. So that blood flow can be smooth, a nice flow.

And when you start having inflammation, it actually creates like ripples, right? It becomes turbulent, right? So you’ve got inflammation, just like if you had inflammation in your bone or on your hand, it’s like the skin isn’t smooth anymore. Like if you have inflammation on your face, your skin isn’t smooth anymore. So when smooth muscle becomes rough and it can get like, and the blood flow starts doing this and it creates like water, like will create a nix.

in the blood vessels guess what gets what lodges in there? Any particle that’s flying around like cholesterol is going to lodge in there and then it creates plaques. Right? So and that will create more inflammation because what happens is when the body perceives that there is something wrong like a foreign object or an injury, it’ll send immune cells which is inflammation to try to heal the area. So the body will send

immune cells to that area that’s in the in the blood vessel that’s been nicked to try to heal it but creates you know a clot or a plaque just like it does when you know you have a you’re bleeding and your body clots to to protect you so that you don’t bleed out. It’s a brilliant design but that’s why we want to you know have inflammation when we need it but not chronically and so the things that can create chronic inflammation

are multifactorial and psychological stress is one of them. So what happens if you think about it, right? If you’re bleeding or if you get cut or wounded, you don’t want that wound to bleed or hemorrhage and you don’t want the wound to get infected. So your brilliant system will send immune cells to that area of the body that’s injured so that it can repair itself and so that it doesn’t.

bleed out so it clots. So that’s what happens when the brain perceives that there is an injury. But that’s what happens when the brain perceives that there is a stress in general. Okay, that’s part of the fight or flight response. So normally, when the brain perceives that the stress is taken care of, that response will extinguish itself, the inflammation goes away. But if the injury persists, or the stress persists, the inflammation persists.

Chris Hall (14:51)
me.

Eva (15:06)
And so what started out as something healing now becomes damaging. So if you’re in chronic stress, psychological or otherwise, the brain perceives that you’re basically injured chronically or the thing that’s injuring you is there chronically, inflammation will be there chronically, and eventually it’s going to damage the system.

Chris Hall (15:07)
All

That’s really good. Yeah. Yeah. So when it comes to stress, you know, you’ve done a lot of stuff on like how to reduce stress and kind of like how to switch a stress from something that’s like happening to you for whether versus something you’re more aware of. Can you kind of go through the steps on that?

Eva (15:44)
Absolutely.

and that’s actually a very important word to distinguish that the minute you think something is happening to you and I use this when I was learning about myself, your brain perceives you to be the victim. Right? So if it’s happening to me, I have no control. Right? It is happening to me. So if it’s happening to me, automatically the brain will jump into victim mode.

Chris Hall (15:58)
you

Yeah.

Eva (16:08)
into survival mode into I need to fight or fly or whatever it is to save my life. And unconscious subconscious level the minute you say this is happening to me. Nothing is happening to you. Everything is happening with you. You are co conspirator co creator. It’s happening. Okay, it is happening like Yeah, yeah, like a tree doesn’t happen to you. A tree is there. How you interact with the tree is up to you.

Chris Hall (16:25)
I really like the term co-creator. think that’s excellent.

coming.

Eva (16:33)
Okay, so it doesn’t mean that things don’t happen that are horrific. Okay, it’s just that, you know, watching our language, it’s happening while I’m here, you know, and so the minute I say it’s happening to me, I become a victim of the circumstances, opposed to it’s happening. And what can I do about it? Right? So life, life is happening with you. So that that’s number one. So when we perceive

Chris Hall (16:51)
I like that.

Eva (16:58)
a challenge that is present that we do not have the ability to handle. It’s very different from when we perceive a challenge that we can’t handle, correct?

Chris Hall (17:06)
Absolutely.

Eva (17:07)
Right. So mindset is important. When we shift our mindset from victim mindset, from a limited mindset, I can’t, I’ll never, this always happens to me. You know, what am I going to do to, got this, or how can I learn from this? I don’t like it, but I’m going to learn from it. I’m going to grow from it. I’m going to make something out of it. How, you know, I get to do this. That already changing the physiology.

Chris Hall (17:09)
Yeah.

Eva (17:31)
the mind-body connection will respond. Plus you have now top-down control. You start accessing the parts of your brain that can make decision and rationalize and intellectualize that have control over your emotions and your responses versus your responses having control over your brain.

Chris Hall (17:45)
It made me think about when my kids were little, one of the things I would say to them is I would say, the two things I would say to them was number one, would say you get to choose your attitude. Whatever happens to you in this world, you get to choose your attitude. So you can choose to be a victim of it, like you’re saying, or you can choose to be a conqueror of it, like it’s been shown for you. And the other thing that I would always say is pain is going to happen, absolutely, but misery is optional.

Eva (18:09)
right the suffering is optional

the suffering is optional that’s and that’s it like you know things happen and they hurt and they do it it hurts and it and we don’t have to like it and we can even have pity parties whatever that may be however what are you going to do with it now what so that’s that’s really a big piece when how do you get there because when you’re hurting when you’re in fight-or-flight you know trying to change that

Chris Hall (18:25)
Right.

Eva (18:33)
You know, that emotional response is like trying to stop a shiver when it’s cold outside. It’s not easy to do. And that’s where stress regulation comes into effect. So the first step is being more self-aware of how am I feeling, what’s going on here, what’s my mental attitude to is being aware that my stress response is now activated. I’m in victim mode or fight or flight mode. That’s okay. So self-compassion. I’m human. I’m allowed to feel this way. And now I can start.

seeing if I can regulate this response. Let me see if I can get this top down control. You can do that through activating the parasympathetic nervous system, through that vagal response, through breathing techniques, mindfulness, meditation, whatever that may be, movement, things that will start lowering the stress hormones and getting that vagal system into control, which is not the fight or flight system, it’s the rest and digest system. It’s gonna allow me to be in.

more in balance and I can get, like I said, get the top down control. And then I can assess my situation and figure out what is it, know, given what is, what can I do?

Chris Hall (19:32)
Well, and then you had mentioned and some of the stuff I’d seen from you is that, you know, when you do breathing, like you have a specific technique, like I were all breathing, right? But like, what would be the technique that you would want someone to use if they feel like, hey, I’m in stress right now, I’m in a or flight mode. What kind of breathing technique do you recommend for people to kind of like bring that system back down from where it’s at?

Eva (19:51)
Well, I

have three that I recommend. One is the one I think they’ve done recent studies with that they found that it’s the quickest is the double breath in and then exhale. So you inhale through your nose and then when you get as far as you can, then you take another breath in.

and then do a long exhalation. that’s, we’ll stimulate that vagal response fairly quickly. So that’s one. Another one that I’ll do is I’ll just have people breathe in on a count of three and then breathe out on a count of six. Again, extending that exhalation will again stimulate that parasympathetic nervous system. And also what happens when we start being stressed, we breathe quickly and rapidly, and which means we’ll start trapping air in the little parts of our lungs called alveoli, which is

really what happens in asthma. And if you do a longer exhalation, it gives the opportunity for all the air to get out of the lungs, which allow the lungs to expand more completely in the next round. And then the third one, it’s a common one of Navy SEALs used, which is the box breath, which is, you know, can imagine you’re creating a box with your breath and you inhale on the count of four and you hold your breath, you pause, and then you exhale on a count of four, you pause.

Inhale on account of fore and pause and exhale on account of fore and pause. And those are all really very effective ways of using your breath.

Chris Hall (21:13)
Great. I actually use a very similar technique when I do meditation. When I do meditation, I’ll do where they do the inhale breath and I’ll hold it and then I’ll exhale it, but I’ll make sure the exhale is like super long. And that is extremely relaxing. Yeah. So I can totally see how that works for, you know, trying to de-stress you out. And then I always use box breathing. Like you just mentioned, I always use box breathing when I get in the cold plunge. Cause, man, that is just…

you know, you just the whole body just seizes up. So the box breathing is very, very good for that too. So yeah, that’s cool. I really like that. So when it comes back to like stress and things like that, you know, if one of the things I also kind of always got into was with inflammation is a C reactive protein. I do you feel like the medical community in general has recognized the value of C reactive protein at this point? Or you do feel like it’s still kind of an outlier?

Eva (22:03)
Well, mean, when it’s a pretty common test, I mean, most people have that tested because it’s a common test to look for if you have if it’s elevated, then there’s likely inflammation happening in your body. The thing is, it’s not specific. It’s not it’s not it’s not a specific test. It’s not telling you where you have inflammation or, you know, what type of inflammation is just saying that you there is inflammation in your body like it could be elevated because you know, you have a virus.

Chris Hall (22:17)
night.

Eva (22:28)
and that’s causing inflammation. it’s not necessarily specific, but you know, it’s so thick, they’re not going to know a lot from it. But in the case of other clinical findings, it’s going to mean something, right? If you’ve got, you know, cardiovascular risk, or you’re coming in with chest pain, and you’ve got elevated C reactive protein, and all these other things within sort of the bigger clinical picture.

You know, right now that there are so many markers, there’s so many biomarkers that people are looking at now that it’s just, it’s gotten a lot more intricate than C-reactive protein alone.

Chris Hall (23:08)
I love that. was it’s like what are the things that cause inflammation and stress? Like let’s just like top three. mean, there’s a million things that cause it but like the top three things —

Eva (23:15)
Food. Let’s start with food.

It’s food. First of all, like stress alone, like I said, can cause inflammation. But the number one in this country is food. So the food that people put into their system is highly inflammatory in the Western world between processed foods and fast foods and the chemicals and additives that are in foods. mean, anything that’s not natural, the body’s going to see it as a foreign object and then it will fight it. So.

Chris Hall (23:26)
you

Eva (23:43)
there you have it. And plus when most of these processed foods will destroy the microbiome which is the gut bacteria which you need to prevent inflammation and to keep nutrients coming through and to keep the gut lining intact. And so if that is off, the balance of those bacteria are off, then that’s going to create more inflammation as well. So one of the fastest and best ways to

reduce inflammation is through getting a nutrient rich diet. And that’s basically, whether it’s Mediterranean diet or the anti-inflammatory diet is your fruits and vegetables, mostly plant-based nuts and seeds, whole grains and lean meats and proteins. And if you have sensitivities, then I recommend doing an elimination diet where you just sort of take everything out and you sort of introduce the things that could be allergens.

slowly but surely, a lot of people need to avoid grains for a while, especially gluten. So it’s not a clear cut for everybody, but nutrition is going to be key. And the other one is sleep. Just even modest sleep deprivation can create more inflammation. So making sure that you’re working on your sleep hygiene, getting off your screen before going to bed, keeping your room dark and quiet, using it only for sex or sleep and nothing else.

No electronics in the room. — All these things are going to support getting adequate deep sleep and all these things are going to be also helping your heart rate variability, which we know is associated with longevity and resilience. So those are just two right there. And then of course exercise moving your body. So these are things everybody knows about exercise, nutrition, meditation and watching your mindset and

also having fun, making sure that you have downtime.

Chris Hall (25:27)
good one too to add in. think that, you know, we do get stuck in these ruts where we just work, work, work. And it’s like sometimes just having fun and letting loose is a good recipe for success. So you had mentioned the gut biome and you had also mentioned earlier that you had prescribed probiotics back in the day and even gotten in trouble for, you know, prescribing it at the time. Like what’s your stance on probiotics now? And I’ll be a little more specific on the question. You know, I think probiotics are great.

I’m really a big fan of it. I have no idea what probiotic to take out of the millions that exist. So like if you go on Amazon right now and you put in probiotic, it’s going to be like a laundry list of things. And they’re all like billions of this and billions of that.

Eva (26:01)
Yeah, it’s very confusing.

Yeah,

so the first step is not necessarily to take a probiotic, but to support your microbiome to regenerate. So that’s going to mean eating foods that are either, you know, have probiotic contact with them, which are fermented like kefir or miso or kimchi or sauerkraut or, you know, things that are fermented.

for those of us who don’t tolerate fermented foods then we find other ways to enhance the microbiome and this is about eating a variety of plant-based foods because the the microbiome and prebiotic fibers you know like artichokes and that sort of thing and onions and garlic they don’t all like the same foods so starting to improve your diet is the first way to go

The other thing is figuring out if your gut is okay. So finding ways to also heal the gut, might mean drinking some bone broth or again, eating the right types of fibers and nutrient dense foods that support the gut to sort of restore itself. So that’s number one. The next thing is that not all probiotics are created alike. It depends on what your issues are. You know, there’s…

Bacteria that support mental health and there’s bacteria that support the gut to heal and there’s bacteria that support weight loss But remember if you are taking something and you take it long term, you’re going to create an overgrowth of those bacteria that are in this product So if you’re going to use you want going to use a probiotic or recommend using it short term, know Like six months, right three months three months on maybe a couple months off so that your body can start rebuilding itself on its own It’s not long term

Chris Hall (27:33)
Good.

Okay.

I don’t

think I’ve ever heard that before. That sounds like really fantastic advice, but I don’t think I’ve ever heard that before. It’s smart though, right? You don’t want to… You have good bacteria, but you don’t want to like overgrow it. Like that’s like too much of a good thing is a bad thing.

Eva (28:00)
Well, we want to remember that it’s all about balance, especially when it comes to the microbiome. Problems don’t happen, know, problems happen because of dysbiosis, which is an imbalance of the life force in there. So we want to get it back into balance.

Chris Hall (28:02)
Yeah.

Yeah.

So everybody heard it, I’m sure, and they’re going to want to know, what is the probiotic for weight loss?

Eva (28:22)
Well, the

one it’s not so much the probiotic for weight loss, it’s sort of the one that’s touted a lot that they they you you’ll see it all the all these celebrities are taking acrimoncia, which is a GLP one acrimoncia, which is a GLP one activator. But again, if you take acumen acrimoncia for too long, you’re then you’ll have an overgrowth of acrimoncia. So — so but you know, there are there are probiotics that I really like.

Chris Hall (28:33)
Commencia.

Right.

Eva (28:48)
But, you know, I would do a short term if you wanted to take these things and then, you know, see how you feel. You know, take a break and let the body sort of restore itself.

Chris Hall (28:55)
Damn.

By the way, I just want to mention for those listening the GLP-1 activator. So GLP-1 is the same thing that you’re hearing when you hear Ozempic, Monjaro. Those peptides are actually activating GLP-1 as well. So we’re talking about activating it through a pathway that’s like more like probiotics instead of medicine. So that’s definitely something to look into if you’re thinking about doing weight loss. So thank you for sharing that. I love that.

So the other one that I was going to say, when it comes to probiotics, what do we do with like these, like these, specifically the prebiotic sodas? Have you seen those? Those are pretty popular. I won’t name a name right now, but there’s a, there’s probably a half a dozen of them out there now. And it’s, you know, they’re, they’re like $2 and it’s basically a soda. that’s, know, they’re using soda water and then, you know, they’re saying that it’s prebiotic. So prebiotic means it’s feeding your bacteria that you have, that you want to keep.

Eva (29:48)
huh. —

huh.

Chris Hall (29:50)
But

anyway, what do you think about those because it seems like they’re really expensive. So if you try to take one of those every day you’d be

Eva (29:54)
No, look, I’d rather eat food.

So I’m not going to tell you not to do that. So this is the thing. When you take something that isn’t food, it’s a supplement. And supplements, right, it’s always going to if it’s not the food itself, you’re taking a supplement. And supplements are meant to supplement. So if you cannot find the time and you’re traveling,

Chris Hall (30:04)
true story.

Yeah.

Eva (30:16)
and you know that you’re not going to be getting food into your system, then go ahead and take a supplement. But if you can, try to get the real thing in. And then you won’t have to take a supplement.

Chris Hall (30:26)
That’s good. That’s good.

Eva (30:27)
So use supplements

wisely is my point. We want to activate the body’s natural ability to do what it can do. But if you keep giving it something outside, it will get lazy and not do it itself.

Chris Hall (30:38)
that’s true too? That actually, you know, that brings a good point of, you know, like when you have certain kinds of bacteria, there are certain kinds of effects. you’ve done, you’ve done, you’ve made some statements about gut bacteria and higher income. Do you know what I’m talking about with that? I, I, maybe you didn’t, maybe you didn’t make a statement, but I guess I would say is there.

Eva (30:40)
Okay.

tonight.

No, no.

Chris Hall (30:59)
Is there any correlation between like, you know, cause this is also financial stuff too. Is there any correlation between like having healthy gut bacteria and like success in business? Is there anything that kind of correlates those two or is that just more of a, think that’s the case.

Eva (31:08)
Well, look.

I mean,

I don’t know. I don’t know that they’ve done those studies yet, but I’ll tell you, I’ll tell you this though. When, you know, I wouldn’t be able to make, you know, a big jump like that, but I can tell you that when your gut is working well, your mind is working well. You know, the gut is known as a secondary brain and it’s directly and indirectly connected to your brain and connected to your mood. Your brain is a Maserati, right? It’s not a pickup truck.

So it needs high octane fuel to work really well. If you have a leaky gut, which means you’ve got holes in your gut or your microbiome is like half there and half not, and you’ve got inflammation happening as a result and you’re not absorbing nutrients as a result, and your serotonin is now dropped because they’re supporting, 95 % of your serotonin comes from your gut and your gut is one of your largest immune organs.

So if that’s not healthy, your brain isn’t healthy. Which means you’re not going to be able to make clear decisions. You’re not going to be able to function at your best. You’re not going to be the highest possible performer. Right? Your mood is not going to be, you know, solid all the time. Your ability to tap into your emotional intelligence will be less so, most likely. Right? So that’s not going to be true for everyone. Some people are fine no matter what’s happening in their gut.

Chris Hall (32:22)
Thank

Eva (32:26)
But eventually it’s going to catch up with them. Especially, you know it’s how hard it is to think clearly or to motivate or to connect with people when you’re So you can make that correlation that if you want to be a high performer and you want to be resilient, it’s one thing to be a high performer, it’s another thing to also be resilient because high performers burn out.

Chris Hall (32:47)
It’s true. Yeah. I do want to talk more about

supplementation. But before I do that, I want to kind of mention, you know, get your thoughts on sugar and the gut biome. You had mentioned ultra processed foods, ultra processed foods or processed foods in general, usually kind of they’re geared up to turn into sugar. But just like, what is the effect of sugar on the gut biome? What is the effect of sugar on arterial walls?

You know what? Give me, can you give me some information on that?

Eva (33:10)
Yeah, well sugar

has a sugar does a lot of things one yes it creates dysbiosis, which is the imbalance of the microbiome, but also sugar spikes insulin, right? So an insulin will create a whole cascade of events that also will be a proponent for inflammation. And then the more insulin that you are causing to spike, the more your body will start becoming resistant to it. They’ll say like, well,

You know, it’s around all the time. What do I need it for? And so then you’ve got essentially, you’re eating sugar. What does insulin do? Insulin pushes the sugar into your cells so they can get energy, right? So that you can make ATP from it. But if your cells are like, insulin, I don’t care, and they become resistant to insulin, that means sugar is now flying around in the bloodstream, but not going into the cells. You’re literally still starving your cells.

So they’re not getting energy. And that’s going to create more inflammation. you’re one, not getting energy, starving your cells, creating more inflammation, and that also is affecting your brain, happening in your brain.

That’s what happens with sheep.

Chris Hall (34:14)
I

read something or saw something where they talked about how like when you have excess sugar, the reason that you have people who go blind or they lose a limb or something like that is because that or erectile dysfunction is another thing with people who have too much sugar. But a big part of that is because people don’t understand like your body is bathing in it now. Like your body’s being bathed in sugar. And it’s like you’re saying like when it’s not being used for its purpose, which is energy, it’s like. At that point, it’s turned into almost it’s basically a poison at that point. Would you agree? Yeah. Eva (34:45) Yeah, pretty much. like I said, the, when the body is brilliantly designed, that’s why I said it will, there are switches that turn on and off and these hormones that say, we need to start working. Oh, we can stop working. And if there’s plenty of something around, they’ll say, oh, we’re good. We can stop. If it’s not enough is around, they’ll get activated to, know, get in more. Right. So if there’s plenty around, the systems will just shut down. Chris Hall (35:13) Yeah, yeah. So just the dose is the important part, right? Which goes into what I was going to ask about supplementation is, know, I, know, 53 years old, you know, probably started taking my first supplement, you know, I think I started taking it when I was about 28. I started taking magnesium because I had heart palpitations. I had a pre-vascular contract contractions.

Eva (35:17)
Mm-hmm.

Chris Hall (35:34)
And a friend of mine was like, Hey, you should try some magnesium. And sure enough, I tried magnesium and they went away. And then one day I ran out of magnesium. I was out of it for like five or six days. Sure enough, the PVC’s came right back. And then I went back into magnesium and then, and then I was gone. And then that was within the first year. Like now, if I were to go a week or two, or even a month without some magnesium, I feel like I’m pretty good. I haven’t had a preventricular contraction probably since I was 28.

But with that being said, know, like every year you read a new book, watch a new video, do a thing. And it’s like all of sudden, I, you know, I remember this cute, this cute little man came out of a doctor’s office one time. was a firm of scrupulis. I was sitting there and his wife was there, another older lady. And she’s like, how’d it go, honey? And he comes out and he goes, good news. He goes, goes, bad news, good news. He goes, bad news is I just got another pill prescribed to me. goes, good news is I don’t have to eat anymore.

because he had so many pills, didn’t have to have food anymore. And so like, I feel like that sometimes when I look at my hand and I’m like, man, that’s a lot of supplements, you know what I mean? So how do we know like if we’re truly deficient in something and how do we know if we’re accurately supplementing it?

Eva (36:43)
Well, this is where I think it’s good to work with somebody, work with a practitioner that can support you in that. And also, why are you taking everything for life? Why are you taking so many things? Really, to ask yourself, am I not getting this from my diet? Am I taking this because somebody told me to? Or is it something that my body really needs? Now, we have precision medicine and genetic testing and.

Chris Hall (36:45)
Thank you.

That’s true.

Eva (37:07)
Some people are fast metabolizers, some people are slow metabolizers, and some people need a certain supplement and other people don’t. Some people need one form of a supplement and then other people need a different form of a supplement because they methylate differently and they metabolize differently or their kidney functions are different. don’t just take something because somebody says you should. First figure out how do I get it from my whole foods.

And if it’s not possible to get from my whole foods like omega-3 fish oils, very hard to get from whole foods because otherwise you’re getting a high mercury load from eating so much fish. ⁓ You you say, okay, well, do I need that supplement? And like, do I have any predispositions or clinical predispositions or genetic predispositions where I think this might be good for me to take, you know, preventively or proactively. So,

Chris Hall (37:37)
Okay.

Eva (37:51)
Do I live in the northeast, which means I don’t get a lot of sunlight in the winter? That’s going to be vitamin D. can get that checked and I might also benefit from taking that. So use your noggin and don’t just take something because somebody said so, but really start thinking about why am I taking these things? What can I get from my diet? And the question is, am I absorbing it? Is my gut working and looking out for symptoms of…

Chris Hall (38:04)
That’s it.

Eva (38:17)
if you have any type of symptoms or showing that your gut isn’t working. I these are things that you can look up. What are signs that my gut is working? What are signs that my gut isn’t working? But I do think that having somebody help you is always good. There’s a lot of wonderful, integrative nutritionists who are available right now, so many health coaches. It’s just not a bad idea to work with somebody.

Chris Hall (38:38)
Okay, yeah, that’s good advice. I do think that, you know, for every pill I take, there’s probably nine that I didn’t, you know what mean? Because I was like, I don’t think that works for me. I don’t think I need that. And then you’re like, but just again, over the course of 25 years, you know, they’re just gonna add up. So

Eva (38:51)
but also do you need them for 25 years?

Chris Hall (38:53)
Good question, yeah, that’s a great question.

Eva (38:58)
You you do

need this for 25 years and there’s and also I also recommend, you know, taking supplement breaks. You know, let your body be without it for a while and then, you know, maybe cycle it, you know, maybe cycle these things. So you’re not the same every season of the year.

Chris Hall (39:02)
Yeah.

Yeah. ⁓

Well, so that actually kind of leads into medicine as well, right? Because like we are in a society where it’s like max dose all the time. You know, like we can, we can get you, we got to get you here so we can make sure that you’re, you know, tolerating it. But then we need to get you here. And it’s like, there’s always, it seems like there’s always this push for more is better when it comes to pharmaceuticals. And, you know, I know that, you know, like,

I’m a really big fan of what’s called minimum effective dose, right? What can you do? What’s the least amount of thing you can take in to get what you want out of it? And I don’t feel like that’s really prolific in medicine. feel like it’s very much like, perfect example is you had mentioned taking breaks, but like these GLP ones, those empics, manjaros of the world, you know, there’s, you know, there’s people that are taking these peptides, not through, you know, the medical world, they’re getting them on their own.

And, you know, they’re taking like three milligrams of something. And then you go and you look at the study, the correlating studies for, you know, I won’t mention any names, the pharmaceutical company that’s using it. And they’re trying to get you on 12 milligrams. So it’s like four times the dose. And then the peptide people, you know, that I, that I listened to, they’re talking about like, you know, you want to take it for eight weeks and then take two weeks off and not pharmaceutical companies. They’re like, this is you for life. You’re to be on this forever. And I just feel like.

You know, it’s such a disconnect between what you’re saying and what the medical community is doing in general. So what are your thoughts on that part?

Eva (40:33)
Yep.

I completely agree, which is why I joined forces with this ⁓ new pharmaceutical company. I was talking about that before we got on. They’re called For Humanity. They’re a new company. We’re launching our first medication next week. And that was the reason why I joined forces with them as their chief of medical affairs, you know, to be out there educating and explaining this to people that when you take something by mouth, first of all, whether it’s a supplement or a medication,

It has to go through the gut and it goes through a first pass effect, which means a good 60 % of it is destroyed by the liver before it goes into your system, which is why they give you such high doses because most of it is destroyed in the gut in the first pass effect. So, you know, that’s why people do sort of ⁓ injection injectables to avoid that first pass effect. So this company is really doing exactly what you.

want to do, which is looking at the minimal effective dose. And how do we deliver that minimal effective dose in a way that is safe, that is faster, that bypasses the gut? And that which means we use lower doses, have less side effects, but also we’re educating people on what this medication is for, how it works, and what are all the other things that you can do to support your body to thrive? What are the other things that you can do through nutrition, exercise, sleep, meditation?

social support, whatever that may be. So it’s a medical technology company that is going to be a place for people to have community, where we can have conversations, where you have education, where you can have coaching, all that sort of thing that it isn’t just about, let me give you the highest dose so that I can make money. And so that’s why I’ve joined forces with them. I’m very excited about it.

Chris Hall (42:12)
That’s cool. What is the drug that you’re coming out with? What’s it called again?

Eva (42:15)
It’s called vigor air. It’s for erectile dysfunction. So it will be an inhaled form, which means it doesn’t have to go through the gut. It won’t take hours for it to work. And it’s at much smaller doses, which means less side effects.

Chris Hall (42:19)
Okay.

Like what, so like traditional.

Okay. So as a pharmaceutical rep, course, like Viagra was one of the drugs that I sold. And so I think most people’s dose in that is around 50 milligrams, but there are plenty of people who had to go to a hundred milligrams as time goes on. Like what kind of dose? ⁓ I had 25.

Eva (42:43)
Yeah, and this will be 25.

Yeah, there was effect at

20, in the pilot study, they did show effect at 20, but they’re going to be starting at 25.

Chris Hall (42:52)
I love that. So how does that work? So it’s an inhaler? So like you would use for bronchitis or something like that or?

Eva (42:56)
Mm-hmm.

No, it’s actually,

it’s, it is. there’s different types of inhalers. There’s like the MDIs and the DPI’s. So the dry powder inhaler is what it’s going to be. The MDI, the ones that you use for asthma are like the technique, like you have to know how to inhale at the right time when you press and the DPI’s, the dry powder inhalers are easier. So to not have to worry about coordination to be able to inhale.

Chris Hall (43:12)
1Mm-hmm.

So that’s where

it kind of smashes the tablet and disperses at the same time. Is that what I’m getting? Is that right? OK. Nice. So will that inhaler have multiple doses inside of it, or will you have to load it every time?

Eva (43:31)
That’s correct.

You know, I’m not really sure. I think right now we’re just starting with the 25 milligrams right now. So ⁓ like I said, this is really new. I just started it like a few weeks, a couple of weeks ago and I’m very excited about it. They’re just like, they’re just such good people, right? To have, work with people in this, in this arena who really care about people. So I’m excited about it.

Chris Hall (43:42)
Peace out.

Okay.

No, great. Yeah.

Yeah,

Yeah,

well, I like that. But by changing the delivery system, by changing the delivery system, you can minimize the dose, which minimizes the side effects, which is, mean, that’s, that’s truly, that’s, that’s, that should be the goal. It seems like, you know,

Eva (44:10)
That’s right.

Exactly and gives you more

control and as I said from the beginning this is about Like not life happening to me, but with me gives you more ownership and control You know when something has to go through your gut it takes a really long time

Chris Hall (44:21)
Yeah.

Yeah,

in the ⁓ in the like, the society of people who were like, gym rats and stuff like that. I mean, I call it bro science. But you know, I think that’s a little disrespectful because they’ve been on to a lot of cool things before other people caught on. But now like the number one pre workout that these guys are touting is like, like a Viagra or a Cialis as a pre workout, because it increases the nitric oxide to your you know, to your body, which is great for getting

Eva (44:38)
Really? Yeah.

That’s right.

Chris Hall (44:53)
all the things you’re doing to get that blood to the proper muscles and stuff like that. know, yeah, meditation is a good pre workout as well. Okay, I’ve never heard that before that also increases nitric oxide or what is it working on different pathway.

Eva (44:57)
So is meditation.

Hello?

Yeah, it increases. I mean, it does many things, but it increases nitric oxide, yes. There’s many different ways to increase nitric oxide. I mean, even through like mild, that’s why it’s sort of a mild warmup also increases nitric oxide. yes. And so does, does beets.

Chris Hall (45:09) That’s cool. Another pro. Yeah, that’s good. Okay, I didn’t know that. Yeah. So I use a product and I’m not sponsored by them, but I’m just going to say it because there’s a lot of different products out there. And I know this one works because it worked for me, but it’s called Super Beats. And it’s just like a little gummy. you know, if you’ve got, if you want to use it as a pre-workout, it’s a great idea, but it also just is really good at getting nitric oxide going. And supposedly again, maybe you can confirm this, that Beats Eva (45:32) Mm-hmm. Chris Hall (45:44) The whole beats idea is that it will help your body start producing more nitric oxide It’s not just like supplementing it is actually trying to teach your body to redo Your own thing is that is that how you understand it as well? Eva (45:56) especially if you eat beets. Chris Hall (45:58) Yeah, right. I’m not gonna eat beets, I’m sorry. I draw the line. Eva (46:02) And then, you know, they have other functions. They’re also found to be really wonderful in Chinese medicine. They help with kidneys and energy and vitality. And the caveat of that, there’s some people who are slow metabolizers and, you know, have different types of physiological responses and increasing their nitric oxide availability increases their ATP or energy and they become hyper-stimulated. So it’s also, you know, if you’re going to Chris Hall (46:27) you Eva (46:28) Improve energy and this is what’s important because some people I’ll just take the supplement and I won’t work out Remember when you create more available energy, you need to use that energy. It needs to go somewhere Otherwise, it just becomes nervous energy Right. So you’re increasing energy and so then I’m going to then deliver it by exercising or moving So if when you take each sugar, for instance, most people then do nothing they sit around Chris Hall (46:48) Wait. Eva (46:52) So now you’re getting all this energy, this ATP is getting made and it doesn’t go anywhere. Right? So just also keep that in mind that if people who are not, you know, utilizers, metabolizers, slower metabolizers, you know, taking too much beats can like for me, if I have beats or at all, they have to be really early in the morning because if I have them later in day, then I won’t sleep. I’m super sensitive. Chris Hall (46:56) me. That’s interesting. Okay. Yeah. Eva (47:17) Yeah, because I’m already high energy and you give me a little bit more and I’m like, my God, might, know, then I’m, I don’t sleep. I’m just wired. So, you know, again, it’s sort of be, you know, pay attention, self-awareness. Like, how do I feel when I take this? What is like, how do I feel when I move like that? How do I feel when I speak like this? So, you know, start paying attention to your own energy. Chris Hall (47:37) Yeah. So it sounds to me like, you know, in general, like probably some good advice is to, you know, work with maybe a nutritionist to find out if you need the supplements that you need or what doses maybe you should take them for. But also the same thing with medications, right? We should sort of review our medications and make sure that we’re not on something chronically that, you know, maybe we don’t need after time. You know, is that because it Eva (48:00) I would work with a health coach alongside with your healthcare provider. I don’t start changing medications without working with your healthcare provider. ⁓ However, having said that, the people that are going to support you the most are people who can teach you how to be more self-aware so you can listen to how your body is speaking to you and how something feels for you. And first and foremost, start working on lifestyle behavior changes. Chris Hall (48:07) you That’s it. Right. Eva (48:28) So change your diet, improve your diet, move your body, get better sleep, do some meditation, and then you’re going to notice whether or not you need these supplements or medications. Medications are band-aids. So are supplements. So when you start building up the body’s reservoir and abilities to heal and thrive, you need less. Now, there’s all sorts of supplements that people are using for longevity, which is a completely different. There’s treating something and then there’s being proactive for something where we’re you know want to live longer and healthier and better with all these other types of Supplements that people are taking again though Do the other things first and then see what do I need to do to support me unless you are having some physical issues? physical or mental issues then again work with the health care provider whether it’s functional medicine or alternative medicine or a health coach, whatever that may be, to address these issues. In those cases, those supplements and medications are going to be necessary to start with. Chris Hall (49:27) So basically it’s more like a building block thing, like the first thing we needed to get right, it’s almost like a pyramid, I guess. And the first things we need to get right are we need to get our sleep right, we need to get our food right, and we need to get our exercise right. Is that right? Eva (49:40) and downtime, right, relaxation. Chris Hall (49:42) yeah. Let’s talk a little bit about meditation. ⁓ So what is to you like a good amount of meditation? ⁓ Is it a daily practice? Is it a weekly practice? you know how many minutes? What does a good meditation practice look like to you? Eva (49:58) Well, look, it’s going to be whatever you do, first of all. So anything that you do is going to be better than nothing at all. Now, what did the study show? 20 minutes a day, right? And preferably twice a day. But if you do five minutes, great. I personally love mindfulness meditation because you could do it all day. You can take a mindful walk, you can eat mindfully, you can take a shower mindfully. Chris Hall (50:01) That’s true. Eva (50:19) that you take to stop this and get calm even if it’s for 10 seconds every hour to bring that stress level down if you wear like an order ring or one or you know an Apple watch or whatever it is an iFit and it’s looking at your heart rate and your heart rate variability and it’s looking at your stress levels you’ll be able to monitor that and give you some feedback that when your heart rate levels and your stress levels are like up here all day, eventually it’s going to crash. Right? So you want it to look like that. Right? So take that break for five minutes, one minute, 10 minutes throughout the day, or do it in the morning and at night so that you know that you’re starting points, you’re starting at a lower point to bring those those levels down to a baseline that’s closer to zero as opposed to closer to 100. Chris Hall (51:07) Great. That’s good. So ⁓ recommendation would be 20 minutes a day. But I think the better answer that you gave on that was just that whatever you can, whatever you will do. Eva (51:15) Whatever you can do. There’s all kinds of apps. Do 10 minutes, do five minutes. know, most of the meditations I have for people, I have one on Insight Timer, but I have a bunch on YouTube and I have CDs and all that. So they’re like under 10 minutes. Chris Hall (51:20) Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know that there was an app I used for quite a while called calm. And that was a good one. I like that I’m my meditation practice now is I have my own certain meditations that I listen to and I breathe with them and stuff like that. But I think like, I think the answer is just kind of whatever you’ll do, right? So if you tell someone, hey, you should do it this way, and they’re not going to do it, then that’s not helping them. So I really like that. Eva (51:48) No, that’s the beauty. There’s all different kinds of ways, a lot of different modalities, distinct, you’re gonna find the thing that works for you and what works for you one day might not work for you another day. But get in touch with your breathing and start that breathing exercises. But like I said, you’ll find something that you like. It could be movement meditation like Tai Chi or yoga. You’ll find the thing that works for you. Chris Hall (52:11) Yeah, that’s great. So I really appreciate your time. It was great having you on. mean, we could probably do this for a really long time. I want to be respectful of your time and try to keep it around an hour. So before we go, are there certain biomarkers for success? Like in other words, like biologically humans that are successful, do they have certain biomarkers? Eva (52:17) Yeah. ⁓ Chris Hall (52:32) that you can go like, yeah, if they have these things, we can definitely tell that they’re probably going to be successful. Eva (52:36) I mean, I don’t know, maybe, but that’s not something that I would know about. And mostly because I don’t really, that’s not sort of something that I’m interested in finding out about. I think that everyone is capable of achieving success or whatever you want to call it. think there’s biomarkers or genetic testing that we can look at it, how we process things, how we metabolize, how we manage stress. There’s certain. There’s certain people that do really well under stress and certain people that don’t do as well under stress, but they both can do really well given the right circumstances and the right environment and our adaptation is different. So the key here is for success is to do what I recommend is to elevate your resilience is through, know, cultivating six pillars, which is your physical vitality through all the things that we discussed today. working on your mental clarity and creating that opportunity mindset and working on your mental aptitude and attitude, working on emotional intelligence and emotional equilibrium. And the more people do that, and we know the studies on how much more people are successful and they make more money, the more emotional intelligence they possess. The fourth is what we all need is relationships and quality relationships because we don’t exist on our own and working on creating and building and nurturing and cultivating quality relationships that support us to thrive. The fifth pillar is our ability to connect to something greater than ourselves, which is our sense of purpose or spirituality or connection or that sort of thing, which we know improves optimism, longevity and success. And the last one is to be self-aware and to take responsibility as yourself as a leader. You might not have a leadership position, but you are a leader because you influence other people. Be accountable for that. Be accountable for the influence you have on others. Know that we’re always in some house shape or form in service to others because we influence others. And when we take accountability for that, again, these are going to be measures of success. So no matter what you’ve been given genetically or whatever is like a biomarker in your system, you can over, we know through mind-body interventions, you can override that. Chris Hall (54:36) Great. I really appreciate that. That’s really good. How can people get a hold of you if they want to learn more about your books and things like that? Eva (54:45) You can reach me on my you can come to my website. We have a contact forum at drselhub.com. That’s drselhub.com I’m on all the social media sites as far as I know I’m posting content usually daily and you could reach out through me there and whether it’s LinkedIn or Instagram or Facebook or what have you and I also have a wonderful new program that’s unlearnworlds.com. That’s L-E-A-R-N-W-O- rlds.com and it’s called the Foundations of Mastering Resilience. It’s a 10 week do it yourself course that is with videos and audio and workbooks and all kinds of stuff and it is you know a lot of what I’ve been teaching you know over the past 20 years in a 10 week program and and that’s available for everybody to to take part in. Chris Hall (55:34) of that. That’s great and so we will have all those links in our description so if you’re you know on YouTube or Spotify and there’s a description you can go down there and find those links real quick and get to her website and learn more about this stuff. So before I let you go is there anything else you’d like to talk about anything that you want to tell the people? Eva (55:53) I think that’s it. think it’s important to know that life isn’t static, things are changeable and you have the power to make that change. Chris Hall (56:00) Yeah, well, you have a really good story and you have a really good story of how you took all of this and made it into something really amazing. So really cool. Thank you so much for being on the show and love to have you back sometime. Eva (56:11) would love that. Thank you for having me. Chris Hall (56:13) Alright, thank you very much. Alright you guys have a good day and drop some comments. Make sure to do the likes and all that stuff that people ask you for because it helps us with the algorithm and it helps us get the message out and if you’re enjoying what you’re hearing, please let people know by liking and commenting. Thank you so much. Have a great day.